interesting article on discipline

[freestuffnut]

hello all... just thought someone might like to read this... made me really think about how i approach disciplining my kids - i think there are varying degrees of what they're talking about, ranging from thoughtlessness right down to real abuse, but i found it very enlightening - not only for how i deal with my two, but also for looking back on my own childhood and realizing how shaming has affected me in my own adult life.
if anyone wants to chat about it, i'd be interested to have a discussion... just pm me? did i get that right?
have a fabulous day everyone! -r.

[freestuffnut]

sorry everyone... i was rushing, can you tell... and i totally forgot the link... so here it is: http://www.naturalchild.org/robin_gr..._children.html
again, *sorry*... if you're still interested in chatting it up i'll be round again later... -r.

[bluebutterfly]

oh man i am reading about my self. i'm not that bad but bad enough i printed it out for my friends and family. thanks for that ausome link freestuff. i found it very helpful now i just feel bad.

[freestuffnut]

heya... omg - everyone's been so sick lately... hope you and yours are fine... the little ones get so slimy! *ew* still, sorry for the lack of reply.
so i know what you mean about the looking at myself - i feel so bad! sorry you do too. and now i can actually see that he does react in some of those ways they listed sometimes. so hard to break bad habits, especially learned ones. don't get me wrong - they're not abused, but i haven't always taken the time to really hear what i'm saying and consider what i'm teaching.
then again - look at what i wrote at the start of this reply: "i feel bad"... my husband noticed the other day, when i started to cry cuz our little guy said "i'm stupid" even though i've NEVER called him that [cuz my parents called me that and i hated it and swore i'd never do that] and Dave said "well that's how you talk to yourself"... fabrulous.
and despite feeling badly - it's good in lots of ways - i'm glad i know and i'm seeing it. kicking myself for having to undo it now though.

[freestuffnut]

oh, and i'm glad you found it helpful too. :]

[freestuffnut]

oh yeah, and i hope you don't mind my asking, and you don't have to tell me, but is that your tat? regardless, it's a sweet one.

[bluebutterfly]

lol no that tat is the one i'm getting next week, i'm getting 2 of them with a star to represent my children, it is sweet tho. lol i let my sister-inlaw take a look at that paper becuse my 1 1/2 year old like to do tantrums, and we always try to tell her grow up, so any way i showed her and she said that she would love to see those peoples diplomas, she thinks we arn't hurting them in anyway. but still i feel really guilty, when i tell my 4 year old to stop the whining, it's like when my mom used to tell me that i was only allowed to cry at funerals, i was not allowed to cry for anything, not like my rents ever hit me or anything, you know, but also i'm doing the same thing to my daughter by telling her to stop her wineing. (sorry for the spelling lol) My mom used to tell me, or acutally i would ask her am i pritty and she would say yeah pritty ugly, i've never said that to my kids or would i ever. my i eventually found out that my grandma used to say it to her, so i guess it is all on how your rents talked to you. What my sister-in-law thinks is her opinion, i agree myself with what the paper said and now i've set up a jar in my house, where if i'm mean or daddy, or anyone else they have to put 1.00$ into the jar. It might help it might not i guess we will see.

[freestuffnut]

lol... as if! i have a jar too! it's my "out of control" jar!!! it's for yelling and general mean stuff... and replaces a half-hour timeout for parents. manoman, i filled that jar up soo friggen quick the first time! mine's only a 25cent fine, but it's more so that when i yell [which has always been a problem with me, i'm from a long line of yellers] my son can see that i'm not above "the law", that it's just not cool to lose control.
as for the discipline... it's a hard one, the line is so faint. i hate the whining... but i suppose they're not "bad" for it. hmm. i did the "whining gets you nothing" for all of it... i'd make him wait till he stopped to give him _____ that he wanted. i have to start it with my daughter now too, cuz she's right at that whining age and it just drives me insane.
with my son i've started the "i always love you but i don't like this behaviour" or "this is a bad way to get what you want"... i don't think it's possible to completely get rid of the word "bad" from everyday language... i think my aim is more to recognize what behaviour he is in control of and what i have to just put into the "he's three" catagory and suck up as a mom. or at least until he gets older and can be better reasoned with.
still, unmaking the "i'm stupid when i make mistakes" is going to be so super hard cuz that's what i'm like, and i'm so beyond being able to redo that in myself. i think i'll have to concentrate on hiding it better and try and make him understand that it's okay to make mistakes. [it wasn't okay, in my family... i still have my old track record that my rents consult every now and again.] it's amazing what tidbits i'm finding from my past.
i think i've passed on the guilt trips though. i realized the other day that i was purposely making him feel badly to change the way he was behaving. whereas i thought i was making him feel compassion - i think i went overboard and was just guilting him out. i felt great after that. but how do you teach them how to feel for others then? how do you do the "how would you feel" without destroying their confidence and making them feel stupid. *sigh*
lol... i guess you talk to other moms on forums and share info. *grin*
as for the tat - you picked a good one. i still have all my drawings and designs for mine, but we haven't found the extra cash yet... my hubby still has a half-finished one done with a prison needle back in the day and then the guy died, so it's still almost done. so he's getting his first and mine'll follow. [hopefully soon] i'm done being preggers for good, so there's hope. :]

[bluebutterfly]

i have a yealling problem as well, i always yell it seems to make them understand what we are trying to say alot more then just taking them aside and talking to them, but hey like i say to my mom what do i know i'm still new to this lol. we got told the other day that one of my husbands friends almost got his kids taken away for yelling at them and it wasn't anything bad he just told them to go to their room cuz they were being bad. and then bang got called on him,the way i think is it's better to yell at your kids than to beat them, but i guess not in theireyes. so i've tried so hard to stop the yelling. as for the whining my oldest daughter does it so much, and it doesn't help because i'll ask her to stop and she'll cry harder almost like i had spanked her. then it doesn't help because her daddy will give her the S*** she wants just to get her to stop. but she has tought my youngest now to do it, but my youngest won't stop at whining she goes into full throttle tantrums, and i can't seem to get her to stop, i used to say "oh grow up" but i guess now that wrong, then i tried to spray her in the face with a water bottle but she thinks its funny, it stunded her enough to get her to stop for about 3 seconds then she was back at it because now she's wet. lol my mom thinks that i need to go to anger managment, and i just look at her and say well maybe if you were to not ground me as much when i was younger then i wouldn't have an anger problem. my mom was an acholic when i was growing up, and it was hard cuz i was the oldest and she used to make me watch my 2 year old brother and 9 year old sister when i had exams the next day, it was hard and then she would yell at me if i failed and i would try to explain stuff to her but she wouldn't listen to me. just yell so i guess i get my yelling from my mom. those are very good questions about teaching them to feel for others one that i don't think that us mothers would ever be able to answer. and i really don't talk to other mother about this kind of stuff, for some reason the information you shared with me, made me relize that there is another mother out there like me that had the same questions that i could maybe talk to so i thank you for that. well as for me i got my tubes tied at the age of 23 so no more kids for me, i could always adopt but we will see what happens.

[HappyCappy]

Well I for one am not a yeller. I do most likely a few things in there. I used to tell my son to "suck it up". when he was little. And I do say things to shame them.

Being a Parent is tough. And I don't think any of us mean to do "bad parenting".

I am for one believer in "following through". If you say "You do that one more time I'll ground you" or whatever the punnishment is. You must FOLLOW through. Don't tell a kid your grounded for a month unless your going to make sure your going to be able to follow through. If you know he's got a birthday party in 2 weeks at your cousin's or something. Only ground him for whatever length of time. Send the kid to his room, and tell him your going to think of his/her punnishment is. Then your giving yourself time to think. And you'll most likely come up with something you can follow through with.
Don't let your anger do the punnishing.

My dad would ground me for like 6 months.(yah right) I was off in a week.

And I used to do the 1 - 2- 3 thing when my kids were little. 3 meaning punnishment arrived.

Yelling in my opinion just makes kids "block you out". I have friends and neighbors that yell".

My daughter used to have a temper problem at age 4. Spanking's never worked. (swat on the bum not a beating) But taking away her "favorite toys" did. And after the first few times, She clued in that mom was serious. Don't do it for long 1 day or something. Your just trying to get a point across.

Another thing that would work. Example if I wanted her to have a bath and she didn't want to.

I would give her 2 choices. She could have a bath or go to bed. Letting it be her decision knowing she would choice the want I want her to do. She would always pick bath. just as an example.

If you think yourself your letting anger rule yourself. Send them to their room, time out chair, or something. And think about it. Give yourself the time to Calm down. Then go and sit in front of them face to face and talk to them about their behavior or why your mad.

I know of a lady that used to call her girls Nasty words and swore at them. Her girls are now teenagers, and yea they don't respect their mom and they call her those names now.

I don't know if any of my suggestions will help you. But as a mother that has had little kids, this is what I found worked for me.

[kisse4ubaby]

I had strict discipline growing up which included the strap and long line of groundings. the worst was when a friend would call and my dad would make me tell them why i was grounded and could not go out. In all honesty think it helped make who i am today.

I've taken every parenting course going and know it all in theory and practical buts till resort to good old discipline myself sometimes and when I am on the brink I do yell and loud yell, at that point i know it time to remove myself and take a hot bath and it does help.

As stated when my kids were young we use to slap them but it got us know where, we did the one two three but only worked with your oldest. My second child was ADHD and ODD and we had to learn new parenting skills and coping skills as they do not respond to the same as other children. Follow through has to be the most important thing for discipline. Yelling and slapping gets you know where but hurting your child and making you feel like rotten, been there done that learnt alot of valuable lessons over the years. Time out and the money jar are also what i use and taking away the favorite thing in the world xbox/computer and stick to it.

I find now a days in society it makes it harder for parents to discipline their children with the fear of being reported and the kids know it. its a challenging time for parents but you learn from experience and thats what friends and family are for and if you can't get it from family and friends do not be afraid to contact local organizations like Phoenix center for family and children. They support parents and give them the skills to carry on and make life better for the whole family. We have to learn we can not cave into other peoples beliefs(like well meaning in laws/parents) but follow through and have confidence in your self as a parent and never be afraid to ask for help(the msot important thing I have learnt).

[kisse4ubaby]

Forgot to mention when you catch yourself belittling your children or someone else think about how it would feel if someone is doing it to us. My husband was abusive like that when he was drinking(alcoholic clean the last 4 yrs)we learnt through counsellings how detrimental it is and we do not allow it in our house anymore. I've seen firsthand the results that come from it and its best to nip it in the butt now then later.

[bluebutterfly]

thanks for the advice happy, i've been yell free for 2 day lol, now when i get mad the girls got their room, and have to stay in there without touching anything for at least 5 minutes, and you know kids they want to touch toys but they aren't allowed to, my husband is quite proud of me, as for my yougest she is still throwing tantrums,she trew a ball at me today because i wouldn't give her a treat. i just ignore her now, and she just gets up and walks away, as for my oldest she started whining becuse i took a toy away today cuz she wasn't sharing, and so since she doesn't like to nap i made her have a nap, an low and behold she fell asleep lol

[HappyCappy]

Awsome work blue butterfly.
Glad us older mom's can give you some tips

[bluebutterfly]

i love getting tips from older moms they know so much, my daughter as i stated in another thred has been so good with helping with cleaning, and stuff that she has saved enough money to pay for half of her bike herself, i told her how proud i was of her and bought her a card that says we are proud of her, my youngest is still doing the tantrum thing that i don't know what to do, as we walked up town she threw a fit in front of everyone i just stood there untill she was done, i think i've let it go on for so long now she thinks she can get away with it, and she is still kinda to young to learn the value of helping out. oh well i will just keep working at it lol